Routing A Link to the Past No Logic midgame

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3 days ago by BoatsAndJoes
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I'm defining midgame as the time at which you've gotten most of your starter items and you begin to check different locations depending on what you have collected.

These are your goals:

  • Get some crystals when possible
  • Get enough items to finish the game

If you're trying to go fast, these goals are a little bit in conflict: rush the crystals or check everything? That's what makes playing for faster times interesting. If you're new, feel free to just get whatever you can reach.

Disclaimer

You can ignore a lot of what's below, either because it doesn't apply to your seed or because you just don't want to do a particular glitch. On the flip side, there is information that may help you that is not listed below. The goal is just to give you some ideas (in both too much and too little detail) if you're feeling stuck.

Rough list of priorities

  • If you can full clear a dungeon + boss in a reasonable amount of time, then do it, especially if you know it's a crystal.
    • If you know it's a pendant, Tower of Hera and Skull Woods bosses can be worth killing for crystal duplication. Most other bosses are usually not.
    • Generally (although it varies quite a lot), you'll be able to tackle dungeons in roughly this order:
      • The more open dungeons are Desert, Palace of Darkness, Thieves Town, and Hera. You'll generally do these pretty early.
      • Eastern and Ice Palace are medium. You don't *need* many items, but these dungeons can get a lot faster depending on what you have.
      • The most strict dungeons are Skull Woods (fire rod), Swamp (flippers/hookshot), Mire (medallion/id swap), and Turtle Rock (somaria/hookpushing). It's rather difficult/annoying to complete these dungeons without those items (still possible with other sets of items, but it will turn into an elaborate heist).
  • If you can't full clear any crystal dungeon quickly, you have to decide between dense overworld/pendant dungeon checks, or an incomplete/slow crystal dungeon.
    • If you collect more overworld items and make fewer/faster trips to crystal dungeons, you may get key items and go faster overall.
    • On the other hand, you could spend a lot of time on non-dungeon checks and it turns out everything you needed was in the dungeons you needed to go to anyway. Judging what path to take takes experience.
    • It's also good to check Sahasrahla and the bomb shop, to get some info on what dungeons have crystals.
    • No single item in No Logic Double Rods is hard required. Leaving one chest behind AKA "orphaning" is not that bad if you don't do it too often (it's still risky, but not as bad as doing it in glitchless).
      • One example of a chest that often gets left behind is Thieves Town big chest. It requires hammer, but the whole rest of the dungeon + village basically just needs one bottle and one sword. That's 10 free items; too good to put off.
  • Chain stuff together when possible. Underworld glitches give access to a lot of fast travel. Mastering the possibilities can take a long time.
  • If you're getting stuck, then just start getting any item that’s available even if it's a bit isolated (e.g. Catfish).

Common midgame route

Way more freeform than early game. You can absolutely deviate from every suggestion listed here; this whole long list is just to give you some ideas if you're feeling truly lost.

The wiki http://alttp.mymm1.com/wiki/Template:ALttP_Guides:_No_Logic and the glitch map https://glitchmaps.mfns.dev/ are more complete lists of everything that is possible; the page you're reading right now is more focused on "stuff that comes up often".

Uncle + Hyrule Castle Escape front

  • Timing:
    • You should do this early if you don't have one of these three big keys: Palace of Darkness/Thieves Town/Ganon's Tower.
    • I will explain why. 4 big keys are called "cave state big keys": Hyrule Castle/Palace of Darkness/Thieves Town/Ganon's Tower.
    • If you glitch from a cave into a dungeon, you normally cannot open big chests and big doors. If you have one of these big keys, you can. It does not matter what dungeon you glitch into: these are the 4 keys that work in cave state.
    • The Hyrule Castle big key drops from an enemy, and most randomizer settings don't randomize keys dropped from enemies. So if you don't have a cave state big key, this is a guaranteed way to get one.
  • Link's house start
  • Run up to castle and take one of the two entrances on the right to Link's uncle (2 items)
  • Go into castle's escape sequence and get all 3 chests + the Hyrule Castle big key from the flail guard.
  • Usually people save and quit at this point. You can get the one item from the sewers dark cross room later if needed.

Kiki skip Palace of Darkness

  • Timing:
    • You can do this pretty much any time with a cave state big key (Castle, Darkness, Thieves, GT). There are dark rooms, but all hazards are despawned. You don't even need a weapon unless you want to kill the boss.
    • Mirror, Hammer, and hearts are nice to help reach/kill the boss. Hookshot can be nice for after you leave. But there are a lot of free items in PoD, so probably don't wait too long.
  • Mountain start
  • Enter the Kiki skip cave. You can get there fast with Kiki Yeet or just walk.
  • Perform Kiki skip https://glitchmaps.mfns.dev/?map=EG1&glitch=ndg-Kikiskip


    • You will be in Palace of Darkness with 255 small keys (generic cave state effect)
    • Although you are on dark world screens, your world variable will still be set to light world (AKA fake dark world). This is nice if you go to hookshot cave after.
    • In this specific case, there won't be any enemies and the floors won't collapse either (because of the way Kiki skip wraps you around the underworld).
    • There also won't be a crystal switch or draggable statues. That's generally not an issue: just don't jump down past the hammer pegs, because you will be locked in (no statue to hold down the switch).
  • Get all of the chests. You can open the big chest if you have any cave state big key. One of the dark rooms with two chests also has some free money on the floor.
  • You can save and quit when you're done, or there are two common continuations:
    • Leave through the front door and reenter to change your dungeon ID from cave to Palace of Darkness. Hold down outside to bounce off the closed door and go back in. Pushing up instead will get you stuck.
      • Option: kill the boss. You can get there either as intended, or through the statue drag glitch https://glitchmaps.mfns.dev/?map=EG1&glitch=dg-Statue-Drag-to-Helmasaur (usually the fastest), or via hookpushing.
      • Since people often go here very early, they may not be well equipped to kill the boss. It doesn't take very long to come back later; it's fine to leave it.
    • Glitch to hookshot cave. There are two ways to do this:

Cave state Thieves Town

  • Timing:
    • This dungeon is pretty quick and easy with just a bottle, cave state big key, and a weapon, if you know what you're doing.
  • The easiest and best entrance most of the time is to do a subtile (green or red potion) YBA from the room south of Link's uncle https://glitchmaps.mfns.dev/?map=EG1&glitch=dg-Uncle-to-TT . This way you enter in cave state and can unlock everything.
  • There's no need to pick up any small keys, but FYI if you pick one up when you have 255, you'll wrap around to 0 which will usually make you have to break into the dungeon again.
    • If you have spent one key and have 254 or fewer, picking up a key will actually cap you at 99 + prevent you from wrapping in the future. So if you don't want to worry about it, just spend a key.
    • FYI these cave state small keys are temporary. The next time you go into a cave, the keys will be set to 255 again. And when you go into the dungeon front door, you'll have your "actual" key count.
  • You will enter in the basement. If you've already bombed the attic from Desert, you can go right next door, get the lady, bring her to the boss room 4 rooms away and fight the boss.
  • If you haven't bombed the attic, you'll need to do that, then go back down to get the lady before fighting the boss (the lady won't follow you into the attic).
  • The fastest route (since you're entering the back) is to fight the boss using the LSD Blind glitch to keep the door open, then go get the chests in the front of the dungeon.
    • While you're getting the chests, leave and reenter the dungeon to change the dungeon ID from "cave" to Thieves Town. You can then go back to the boss room to collect the crystal/pendant.
  • Alternately you can get all of the chests first, and then fight the boss. It's barely slower and you don't have to do the extra glitch (although the glitch is very easy).
  • Whenever you're done with the dungeon and leave, you will be on the dark world Village of Outcasts screen, but your world variable will be set to light world (fake dark world).
    • This means you can get all 3 Village of Outcasts items.
    • If you have mirror, you can mirror to real dark world and do some dark world overworld checks on other screens. It's possible to work around not having moon pearl, but annoying.
    • Whether you have mirror or not, you can overworld transition without mirroring to go back to light world, if you want to do some stuff in Kakariko or Desert.

Tower of Hera

  • Timing:
    • Usually you just defeat the boss whenever. It's quick and you can use a dead Moldorm to collect crystals for other dungeons later, like Swamp and Mire.
    • Waiting for hookshot or the big key makes it easier to get to the boss. If you don't have them, you can still come in from another dungeon, like Palace of Darkness, unlock the big key door from the back and then exit+reenter to set your dungeon ID to Hera http://alttp.mymm1.com/wiki/Palace_of_Darkness/No_Logic#Where_you_can_go .
    • Waiting for a better sword or for hammer can make the boss fight a lot easier.
  • Generally don't check the basement. It takes ages, and the small key can often be put to better use in other dungeons (like Swamp).

Desert

  • Timing:
    • Generally you get the items early (since it's near Kakariko), and you can defeat the boss whenever. Unlike Hera, killing the Desert boss is mostly just for the crystal.
    • The boss kill gets easier and faster with more items like fire rod, so it's not a high priority.
  • You can reach the inside of the rocks with a teleport and get to the boss as intended, or with a spin YBA/mirror door, or with hookpushing.
  • The door used for the glitch will suck you in, so generally you'll have to use bombs to get on the right pixel, or or have some setup to time your potion properly.

Eastern Palace

Remaining light world overworld checks

  • Timing:
    • Whenever it's convenient or everything else is looking inconvenient.
    • If you're getting every item you want, theoretically you could never check any of these, but most of the time you will at some point.
    • Some people like to do these in the early game. Some people like to delay them to save time overall; it's up to you.
  • Sahasrahla
  • Back of escape:
    • Super quick to reach from the graveyard using gloves. Moderately quick to reach from the graveyard using swim clip.
  • The rest are pretty isolated (e.g. King Zora, sewer dark cross) but go ahead and get them if it's convenient or you really need more items.
    • I will point out specifically that Lumberjack ledge item is generally not worth getting.
      • You must kill Agahnim 1 to get it, which will remove easy access to fake dark world and spawn guards everywhere.
      • One nice thing is it's quick to scout the item to see if it's worth going through that (most of the time it's not).

Dark world overworld checks

  • Timing:
    • Pretty much the same as light world checks if you have moon pearl. Simply clip down the mountain and walk around picking stuff up.
    • You can also use a glitch like YBA to get from light world to fake dark world, and then use mirror to get to real dark world.
    • You can also *gasp* use the intended portals sometimes. You can't always wait around for hammer and titan mitts though.
    • With no moon pearl, you can still get off Death Mountain with Bunny Death Mountain Descent and get some of these.
    • Getting *everything* would be slow while constantly working around bunny, but getting a handful of high priority checks e.g. Hype Cave isn't too bad.
      • The easiest way to turn from bunny into Link is to Fake Flute with a blue potion http://alttp.mymm1.com/wiki/Fake_Flute and then pull on a pullable object like the one near hype cave. https://imgur.com/a/tree-pull-spots-lttp-3yErC This gives Link state.
      • When you transition between a cave/dungeon and the overworld, you will turn back into a bunny. So basically you can check one indoor location (like Hype Cave or Mire shed) before losing Link state.
  • Hookshot cave/superbunny cave/village of outcasts: the most convenient places to reach with glitches, whether you have moon pearl or not. Explained in the Palace of Darkness/Thieves Town sections.
  • Hype cave: free with moon pearl, trickier without but often worth it, especially since you can get crystal info from bomb shop (even as bunny).
  • Mire shed: same idea as Hype cave but less value. It's nice to scout which medallion is required to enter the Mire front door. It is near Outcasts and dig game, if you have moon pearl.
  • Pyramid fairy: via swim clip. https://glitchmaps.mfns.dev/?map=DW&glitch=ndg-Pyramid-Fairy-swim-clip
  • Ol' stumpy: gives superbunny state. Can be a bit awkward to reach as bunny, though. https://glitchmaps.mfns.dev/?map=DW&glitch=ndg-Bunny-to-Stumpy-mirror-wrap
  • Rest (e.g. Catfish, Spike Cave) are a bit hard to get to, but go ahead and get them if it's convenient or you really need more items.

Skull Woods

  • Timing:
    • Going in and getting some items is pretty easy even without moon pearl (via either Bunny Death Mountain Descent or mirror from fake dark world Village of Outcasts. Both are nearby).
    • The boss can be hard both to reach and fight (fire rod helps a lot). But still, it's not the most closed-off dungeon.
  • Once you go in, if you're bunny, you can die on purpose to get Link state. This also puts you in fake dark world, so you will keep Link state while going outside.
  • You'll generally want at least one small key to reach the boss.
  • You need fire rod or hookpushing to reach the boss. And the fight can be pretty tough.

Ice Palace

  • Timing:
    • Pretty much whenever you can complete it and you don't have anything better to do. It gets faster with cane and glove+hammer, but not *that* much faster.
    • You need fire rod or the bombos medallion to kill the boss. You may need some bottles if you're missing gloves, hammer, or keys.
  • To get in from cave state (for unlocking or just for fast entrance), you can north subtile YBA from Kakariko well. https://glitchmaps.mfns.dev/?map=EG1&glitch=dg-Kak-Well-to-IP


    • Remember in order to collect the crystal, you'll have to leave and re-enter from the front door.
  • You can also get in the front from dark world with some other tricks depending on what you have (flippers, mirror, moon pearl).
  • You can skip the lobby (and the fire requirement) with a bomb clip. But if you have no fire, then you can't kill the boss at the end.
  • Icebreaker is a nice way to speed up the dungeon, http://alttp.mymm1.com/wiki/Door_State_Extension and the bottom floor button can be pressed with a Somaria block. So Somaria is very nice (but not required).
    • Icebreaker is considered a "minor" glitch, but it's about the same difficulty as other glitches (not easier, maybe a bit harder if anything).
  • In the final room, you can get into the boss fight without hammer/glove either with a YBA https://glitchmaps.mfns.dev/?map=EG1&glitch=dg-Kholdstare-Spin-YBA or a hookpush.

Swamp

  • Timing:
    • It's pretty quick to clip into the back and get some items and even kill the boss without flippers or hookshot, but getting the crystal can be difficult.
    • The problem is that you need to go in the front door to be in Swamp Palace state, but then you have to deal with the water immediately (and fake flippers alone won't work because of special layer-checking), and hookshot in the main hub.
    • There are a few ways around this which will be described below. Most of them are kind of slow, so Swamp should go near the end (in case you get some item help later); maybe not before Mire (similarly hard) or Turtle Rock (fast to get from Turtle Rock to final boss).
  • If you have hookpushing equipment, you can hookpush to the right to get to an unused room next to the Skull Woods boss room. If you have already defeated the Skull Woods boss, the Swamp crystal will drop.
  • With basically no items you can Fake Clippers. This method is rather difficult: harder than other glitches which are used regularly. Still, it's firmly doable, especially with buffering. https://www.twitch.tv/videos/2170750373
    • Whether you're using fake or real flippers, the front must be flooded. It unfloods when you go through an overworld transition.
      • The glitchless way to do this is to portal to dark world, walk to Swamp Palace, mirror to light world, enter the dam, pull the lever, take the mirror portal back to Dark World, and enter the palace.
      • The simplest way to do this if you don't have mirror/moon pearl is to drain the dam, save and quit, start at Mountain, go to Tower of Hera (or Kiki skip and then YBA to enter Hera in cave state http://alttp.mymm1.com/wiki/Palace_of_Darkness/No_Logic#Where_you_can_go ), and clip to Swamp https://glitchmaps.mfns.dev/?map=EG1&glitch=ndg-Hera-to-Swamp-Clip . The room will still be flooded.
      • Don't forget to exit and enter the front to set your dungeon ID to Swamp. To get out, you will need a Hera small key or bring other keys/cave state to Hera and then to swamp.
    • If you don't have hookshot to reach the back, you can still collect the crystal by going from Swamp to Hera via a YBA https://glitchmaps.mfns.dev/?map=EG1&glitch=dg-SP-to-TH
  • Another way to get the crystal if you're uncomfortable with other methods is Dungeon ID Swap. That's still often the best way for Mire. For Swamp, if you are comfortable with other methods, other methods are faster.

Turtle Rock

  • Timing:
    • It's reasonably easy to get into any entrance, especially with mirror/moon pearl.
    • Some of the items are super free to get, like Laser Bridge. So they can be worth checking if you need items.
    • Ideally you complete Turtle Rock last, since it's easy to get from Turtle Rock to Agahnim 2. But if you gotta go earlier, you gotta go earlier (there are a lot of fast items here).
  • It's easier to enter with moon pearl, but still possible without (with for example Overworld Conveyor). Look on the Turtle Rock No Logic page on the wiki, or around dark death mountain on the glitch map.
  • The items which require fire rod can instead be obtained with just cane https://glitchmaps.mfns.dev/?map=EG1&glitch=dg-Roller-Room-STC
  • The big key and cane can be skipped with hookpushing or with a double YBA https://glitchmaps.mfns.dev/?map=EG1&glitch=dg-Trinexx-YBA-pt-1 , but it is tricky.
  • The boss cannot be defeated without fire rod and ice rod. You'll also probably want half magic, a magic potion, or the magic refill glitch.

Misery Mire

  • Timing:
    • Like Swamp, it's pretty easy to clip in and get the items + defeat the boss, but harder to get the crystal.
    • You need the medallion to enter the front door, so if you don't have it then your only option is dungeon ID swap (requires bottles or cane. With stuckpushing, you can skip cane and only need one bottle). http://alttp.mymm1.com/wiki/Dungeon_ID_swapping
  • If you clip into Mire from some other dungeons, like Eastern, the slime will be solid, and if the boss dies inside it, you cannot get in to pick up the boss drop.
    • You *can* still fight the boss this way, but you have to lure the eyeball out of the slime (without getting the boss stuck in the wall) before killing it.

Ganon's Tower

  • Timing:
    • If you want items to do more dungeons, especially if you already have helpful GT items like keys, hammer, and fire rod.
    • It takes a while to clear out GT, but it does have a lot of checks in it.
  • You do not need all of the crystals to clip into GT https://glitchmaps.mfns.dev/?map=DW&glitch=ndg-Ganon's-Tower-clip
  • You can also clip in as bunny and then die on the spikes to continue as Link.
  • You can also enter in cave state.
  • Generally, at the end of the game you will not climb GT to reach Agahnim 2. It's much faster to glitch into the boss room e.g. by wrong warping from Turtle Rock.

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